Just a question on the moving beyond the food luring stage.  I understand that we want the dog move past the food luring and to start thinking their way through this.  Mark talks about getting into the rhythm of this exercise and the dog will move past this stage themselves.  

I think I am there with my own dogs as whenever they now see their touch pad (I use the upside down rubber bowl) they can't get their feet on it fast enough.  I like their enthusiasm for this exercise but now I feel like I've lost some control. 

Mark mentions in the written section in between the videos moving to hand luring and then to a leaning gesture (did I read that correctly?) but didn't go into detail on putting a gesture into the training.  

When going beyond the basics, do you use a wait/stay command and then tell the dog to go on the touch pad (visual or verbal)? 

Hi Amanda,

I have understood Marks videos and written parts in the following way:

Once you have reached a good rhythm in a high drive stage, occasionally interrupted with duration, we should  begin to gradually fade out our food luring to a mere handluring, which a bit later we will also fade out with a leaning gesture towards the touch pad.

I have done it this way with my dogs. Two of them step now on three different objects without I am luring with my hand nor bending towards the object.  More exactly I give a verbal command, then approach the item and then stare at it -  (which I guess is a kind of lure too).  With my third dog, it doesn't work yet like this. She still needs that I bend towards two õf the items  and to the third one I still have to lure a bit with my empty hand.

I think, if you follow the principles as Mark describes, rhythm, high drive phase, from time to time asking for duration, you will certainly overcome the luring. Keep in mind that Mark warns from remaining in the luring stage for a long time, but we also must avoid to stop it abruptly. It depends on the dog, how quickly we can advance, each one is different.

About making them stay before making them step on the touch pad, I don't know for sure. I don't do it yet. I think this would be a more advanced thing, as we would chain two different behaviours and probably confuse the dogs.

Good luck   ~  Christina

I too refrain to train a stay command for this. First is the rythm using a short word in Portuguese which means "go up" and of course gradually fading out the physical lure - as Mark and Victoria describe. For duration now and then I only use Mark's "good... good..." . "Stay" is reserved for completly other exercises. "Go to your bed" though means, she has to remain until released, but not in the sense of a formal stay, just in any position which is comfortable for her.

Using the verbal marker system that Mark uses and it seems most of the trainers at Leerburg, there is no stay command. I don't use one either. It depends on how you mark. You either mark with duration, which implies stay, or you release.